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【20141027】【翻译】用个思考实验让人们清醒地知道,为什么说那

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用个思考实验让人们清醒地知道,为什么说那些说林需要带领第二阵容的论点是令人不安的”
A Thought Experiment to Wake People Up to Why the Argument for Jeremy Lin being Needed with 2nd Unit is Disturbing

http://www.jeremylintel.com/2014/10/23/a-thought-experiment-to-wake-people-up-to-why-the-argument-for-jeremy-lin-being-needed-with-2nd-unit-is-disturbing/


IP属地:美国1楼2014-10-27 12:44回复
    原贴:http://tieba.baidu.com/p/3374391732
    翻译:吃白兔的胡萝卜


    IP属地:美国2楼2014-10-27 12:47
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      Sounds logical enough, right? Well, what if, instead of Jeremy Lin, the Lakers have someone like Dragic (or insert ANY PG not named “Jeremy Lin” that’s better than Price) as the Point Guard. Do you think there would be ANY discussion about whether or not Dragic should start? Of course there wouldn’t. And you know why? Well, because Dragic is a starting point guard, of course. It’s obvious! Dragic doesn’t belong with the second unit. Are you out of your mind?!
      听起来很有道理,不是吗?好吧,如果说这个不是林,假设湖人拥有德拉季奇(或者说任何一个比普莱斯好的控卫)这样的控卫。你觉得还会有任何关于是否德拉季奇应该首发的讨论吗?当然不会有,你们知道为什么,当然是因为德拉季奇是一个首发控卫。着很明显,德拉季奇不属于第二阵容。你跟上我的思路了吧?!
      So how come with Dragic on the team instead of Lin, the Lakers’s second unit suddenly don’t need any help? Suddenly, Price is more than capable of running the second unit? Isn’t Dragic better than Price? I thought we wanted the better point guard to run the second unit, since the second unit needs SO much help. At least that was the case when it was Lin on the team, instead of Dragic. So how come it’s no longer the case now? And don’t we need Dragic to be with Davis so he can run PnRs with Davis? Also, suddenly with Dragic on the team, Kobe is no longer a ball-dominant guard?
      所以如果德拉季奇在湖人而不是林,会发生什么呢?湖人的第二阵容突然不需要任何帮助了?突然,普莱斯有能力带领第二阵容了?难道不是德拉季奇比普莱斯好吗?我认为我们需要更好的空位带领第二阵容,因为他们非常非常需要帮助。至少,如果林而不是德拉季奇在球队,那就是这样的。为什么这个就不成立了呢?难道我们不需要德拉季奇和戴维斯一起打挡拆吗?而且,突然地,德拉季奇在球队中,科比突然间不在是需要大量球权的后卫了?


      IP属地:美国4楼2014-10-27 12:53
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        Of course, I care about Lin’s career, etc. but to me, THIS goes beyond what Lin wants (although I know Lin wants to start, regardless of what he says to the media (the media neglects to report the part where he says, “Of course I want to start. Anyone would.”)). THIS is not even about what’s good for Lin. So this is not about me being some fanatic Lin fanboy who wants Lin to start just so we can say Lin is a starting point guard or whatever.
        当然了,我关系林的职业生涯,等等。不过对于我来说,这个超过了林的要求(尽管我知道林想要首发,无论他在媒体前面怎么说(媒体忽略了他说的:“当然了,我想要首发,每个人都会想的”),这个甚至无关于如何对林最好。 所以,这个和我是一个非常希望林首发,这样可以说林是一个首发控卫的超级林密没有关系。
        My anger is not really about me wanting Lin to start if that makes any sense. This is about shedding light on the double standard that Lin often faces. You can’t have it both ways! You can’t say that Lin is a starting-caliber point guard on the team, but shouldn’t start, because he’s more needed with the second unit, but at the same time say that Dragic is a starting-caliber point guard on the team, so he should start. In other words, you can’t say Lin is good, so he needs to be with the second unit, but at the same time say that Dragic is good so he needs to start.
        我生气地不是因为我希望如果正常的话,林打首发。而是关于林经常面临的双重标准的问题。你不能两个都占了。你不能说林是球队中有首发能力的控卫,因为第二阵容需要他,他不应该首发。但是能同样的情况,德拉季奇是一个有首发能力的控卫,所以他应该首发。换句话说,不能因为林很好,所以他需要和第二阵容在一起,而同时说德拉季奇很好,所以能够首发


        IP属地:美国6楼2014-10-27 12:58
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          So there is something disturbingly wrong from a logic standpoint, when people admit that Lin is the starting-caliber point guard on the team, but are incessant about relegating him to the second unit. And I think a lot of this has to do with the fact that McHale has brainwashed the league into feeling like Lin belongs with the second unit, when McHale took away his starting spot last season.
          所以,这里是让人烦恼的逻辑错误,当人们羡慕林在球队中具有首发能力的时候,却不断地把他流放到第二阵容。我觉得这个主要原因是,上个赛季麦克海尔把林的首发拿走的事情给联盟洗脑,让他们认为林是属于第二阵容的。
          Somehow, when it comes to Lin, simple logic doesn’t apply. That’s the double standard that I’m trying to highlight and that’s why I’m pissed off at these arguments, because I think they’re made by well-meaning people who sort of don’t realize what they’re really saying. This is really not about Lin starting or not starting, it’s really about the fact that it’s disturbing we’re even having this conversation. Because if it was someone like Dragic, rather than Lin, on the team this discussion would not exist.
          然而,到了林,这么简单的逻辑却不适用了。这就是我要指出来的双重标准,也是为什么我非常讨厌那些观点。我觉得可能因为那些好心人根本就不知道他们说的是什么。 这不是林首发不首发的事情,而是我们在讨论中,让人很讨厌的事。因为如果有人比喜欢林更喜欢德拉季奇,那么在球队中,这个讨论就根本不存在。


          IP属地:美国7楼2014-10-27 13:00
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            首发跟带第二阵容是两个并不违背的概念,小林跟kobe如果都上32分钟,两人有16分钟重叠,大可首发完再分别去带第二阵容,nba可没规定首发就不能带第二阵容
            所以用第二阵容需要人带.所以小林不能首发就是个伪议题,骨子裏就是不想让小林首发.或觉得小林不配首发.


            10楼2014-10-27 13:53
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              还有很多人说只要最后关键时刻能在场上就好,首发不重要,我想请问nba是能打首发的人留在关键时刻的比例多,还是替补打关键时刻的比例多?
              放弃首发更难保障你能打上关键时刻,这是我的看法,教练也不可能用你去打替补,关键时刻我就让你上来当交换条件.
              小林坐上替补就是打的好你还是替补.打不好那对不起可能你还要跟第二替补分享上场时间,小林在火箭就是这样被边缘化的.


              11楼2014-10-27 14:12
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                我很想问小林的一个问题是:你今年在湖人打了一年替补的话,明年你会有兴趣跟湖人续约吗?


                12楼2014-10-27 14:16
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                  说书豪打得比队内另外的控卫好所以需要书豪去带第二阵容的此种说法!根本就是似是而非,荒谬可笑且非常可恶的另类欺压手法!别人打得好就可以顺理成章成为先发人选!唯有书豪因为打得比别人好却必须活生生硬是需要被按在替补群里带第二阵容!怎麼看怎麼说怎麼想都是令人愤恨难平,无法接受的谬论!真心希望湖人队不要再拿这种莫须有的理由强加於书豪身上!恳请给书豪一个绝对的公平公正机会!书豪必将全心全力的尽心回报湖人队的知遇之恩!


                  13楼2014-10-27 15:47
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                    14楼2014-10-27 17:47
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                      阴谋论再现江湖?


                      来自iPad15楼2014-10-27 21:01
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                        感谢搬运与翻译


                        16楼2014-10-27 22:54
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                          以上都很合理!我的思考方式更简单:
                          1. 湖人只要比照太阳之於德拉季奇、勇士之於库里,快艇之於保罗、……,正常使用它的首发PG就行了
                          2. 反过来说,湖人最能放心使用的那位PG,就应该是它的首发PG


                          IP属地:中国台湾17楼2014-10-27 23:55
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                            我认为讨论小林先发与否这件事
                            根本就不应该存在
                            有看过哪个当打之年、本来就是先发的球星
                            一直被讨论要不要替补的
                            就像文章中提到
                            像这种讨论里
                            只要把小林的名子换成别的一级控卫
                            大家都觉得荒谬
                            那为什麼名子是小林就得合理
                            逻辑有问题吗...
                            真是莫名其妙


                            18楼2014-10-28 07:08
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                              现在在就是这样了


                              来自iPad19楼2015-02-09 19:15
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